Author Topic: Virus vs. Ifrit  (Read 2867 times)

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Offline Kero

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Re: Virus vs. Ifrit
« Reply #15 on: September 02, 2012, 09:57:05 PM »
(( The claws were not stated to happen at the same time he went for the bite so it must have been after he tried to grasp his throat.

Being 'out of the direct line of attack' means he is not facing Ifrit's front and is facing his shoulder. A lion cannot spread their front legs that far to try and tag him in the ribs and the flank. At best he could get would be the shoulder (with the opposite arm) but his ribs and rear are too far to reach. If he used the arm that Virus was facing then he would not be able to attack him at all because he cannot move his arm that far back and outwards unless he actually backed up, which he had not stated in his post, and the flank would still be out of reach for that as well.

As for being slid around, you would argue that the fact they are in water could help move him to the side.

Btw your diagram confuses me >D ))

Offline Sukara (2 RPs)

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Re: Virus vs. Ifrit
« Reply #16 on: September 02, 2012, 09:58:52 PM »
Actually, yes it does;

"Ifrit would attempt to put his head under the wolfs chin, turning his head to close around the wolfs throat.

While his front right leg came around to knock the wolf in the ribs and grab hold with his claws at the flank. "

Obviously if Ifrit is going for the throat, he's have to shift a bit so it's safe to assume he does. He's going for the throat right after he gets clipped in the ear. Ergo he's turning and going for the bite, Virus is pivoting out of the way, but the claw is still being swiped while he does that which kinda hinders Virus' shoulder to shoulder position
« Last Edit: September 02, 2012, 10:00:52 PM by Sukara's In Love {To Do: 11 RPs; I:31st; S:4th; F:5th; B:15} »

Offline Kero

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Re: Virus vs. Ifrit
« Reply #17 on: September 02, 2012, 10:03:34 PM »
You missed my second argument dear.

Offline Sukara (2 RPs)

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Re: Virus vs. Ifrit
« Reply #18 on: September 02, 2012, 10:14:31 PM »
So use that arguement in your next post? It's a valid arguement but the claw swipe itself is still plausable.

Imagine Ifrit turning his body to face Virus, which he'd have to if he's going for the throat, and swiping at the same time.

The way I see it is this:
-Headbutt hit, Virus is slid to where he's angled facing Ifrit's shoulder area. While in mid slid, attempts to bite Ifrit's eye.
-Instinctually Ifirt ducks his head, placing his ear where his eye would be, ear gets hit.
-Right as ear gets hit he attempts his throat attack, while also swiping his claws. (obviously this would require him to turn a bit considering Virus' current position so although they aren't exactly face to face they're pretty much to the point of facing each other enough for the swipe)
-As the throat attack is being attempted, Virus lands and does his pivot. (Which would be a reasonable dodge)

PROBLEM
However the swiping is still occuring at the same time the throat attack was, so timing wise close to when Virus landed and began his second pivot to get to shoulder to shoulder. However swiping arm is hindering that because he's swiping from the direction Virus is pivoting towards.

So, honestly, I say the fight should continue and in your next post you'd have to address the swipe. It is plausable though, if anything Ifrit would have to edit is to legitimately say he turned to face Virus as he's going for the throat which can be safely assumed since Virus' throat isn't right in front of him after the ear clip.

If you want we can bring it to an MO team discussion but I honestly don't see what's invalid about Ifrit's post/attempts

Offline Kero

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Re: Virus vs. Ifrit
« Reply #19 on: September 02, 2012, 10:20:15 PM »


Made this sketch to try and show what I meant that he couldn't be able to reach Virus's ribs or flank. Orange dotted lines being the max length he could attack by, including arches for both paws, and roughly where his paws would land if he tried to attack Virus at this angle. Even if he turned a bit, he would be unable to reach his flank.

Offline Master Gunner Fluttershy

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Re: Virus vs. Ifrit
« Reply #20 on: September 02, 2012, 10:34:28 PM »
Even your attack range was accurate. He'd still attach his claws to something on the wolfs lower body and hold him. But for the sake of realism, let me try a bit of math. Ifrit is 5' tall at the shoulder. I'd say 1' 6" or around there to where his arm actually begins. I have about 3' of attack range where his shoulder is. And I'd say a dire wolf isn't longer than 3'. So I think I'd be able to hit the flank. But still, if not, I think Ifrit would still hit something with those claws and hold you there.

Edit: And Sukara, if you want me to edit my post, just send me a message with what you want me to change. Or send me a message with the changes you think are necessary and I'll just copy and paste it to over the old post. Thank you <3
« Last Edit: September 02, 2012, 10:38:23 PM by Scorn Hellfire »

Offline Sukara (2 RPs)

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Re: Virus vs. Ifrit
« Reply #21 on: September 02, 2012, 10:40:43 PM »
Not only that you didn't say he landed in that angle, snapped at the eye, then pivoted. You said that the eye attack was happening during mid slide so I see it as Virus would be a little more at 3 o clock, according to diagram, when he went for the eye.

Ifrit ducked, got his ear clipced, and as his ear is getting clip he's going for the throat. Which is safe to say he's turning towards virus to do so and quickly swiping. Your diagram would be accurate if Ifrit didn't move but he's going for the throat right after his ear was clipped which means he'd have to turn. If you need scorn to edit that he turned specifically then he can do that but otherwise I still don't see it. Do you want me to put it up for discussion to the team to get other persepctives?

For Ifrit to go for the throat I can see his body turning in a *( angle witht he top being the curve of his head going for the neck and the botom being his flank. Right arm going for the swipe. So they're not directly faceing each other straight up but he's still angled facing him
« Last Edit: September 02, 2012, 10:43:38 PM by Sukara's In Love {To Do: 11 RPs; I:31st; S:4th; F:5th; B:15} »

Offline Master Gunner Fluttershy

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Re: Virus vs. Ifrit
« Reply #22 on: September 02, 2012, 10:46:54 PM »
Quote
Before he was finished being wheeled around by the feline's superior strength, teeth snapped in the air, aiming for the lion's eye in an attempt to blind him, the bottom fangs reaching directly for the socket but would retract quickly to keep from getting a face full of claws. Regardless if he got the eye or not, his rear paws kicked off of the ground as they landed from the lion's push and rotated his body so that he was side by side of the cat, shoulders nearly touching.

You clearly stated he was going for the snap while he was in the air. Then landed. Then pivoted.

Offline Kero

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Re: Virus vs. Ifrit
« Reply #23 on: September 02, 2012, 10:51:18 PM »
I think you may be off on the mathematics Scorn.

An average grey wolf can measure 32 to 34 inches at the shoulder and a length of 41 to 63 inches in length. Taking the average of that and applying it to Virus...

Average grey wolf being 33 inches at the shoulder and a length of 52 inches
Virus being 36 inches at the shoulder. Length unknown.

33  x  36
52       ?

52 x 36 / 33

Virus would have a length of about 56.7 inches, I'll round it off to 57 inches which gives Virus 4'9" of length, not 3'0"


I won't discuss this further as I had discussed this previously with Dev before I posted my concerns the other day. I'll leave it up to the MOs now.

Offline Master Gunner Fluttershy

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Re: Virus vs. Ifrit
« Reply #24 on: September 02, 2012, 10:58:51 PM »
I still think that's fairly close. Because I'm not counting the extra length of the neck and head because he is so close to Ifrit and I'm assuming Ifrit is under his chin. If he isn't then Ifrit would at least get his shoulder or ribs. Possibly breaking or fracturing a rib and as I put in my post. Ifrits primary target would be a leg, if I can get one, that's what I'll take.

Edit: And might I say that's a really long wolf. lol. I have a half mastiff, half st.bernard mix. And she is about 3 feet long. But I guess a wolf is a bit longer than that.
« Last Edit: September 02, 2012, 11:00:19 PM by Scorn Hellfire »

Offline Sukara (2 RPs)

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Re: Virus vs. Ifrit
« Reply #25 on: September 02, 2012, 11:21:55 PM »
I'll bring it to the other MOs, but to be clear Kero can you give me a brief explaination as to what your concern is?

Same for you Scorn, give me a brief arguement as to what your soluation/answer to Kero's concern and I'll post it up. They can read all this on their own XD

Offline Master Gunner Fluttershy

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Re: Virus vs. Ifrit
« Reply #26 on: September 02, 2012, 11:24:50 PM »
All I'm saying is if I can't grab him with a bite. And I can't hit his flank. Seeing as Ifrits arm is in the way. I still think Ifrit would grab something with his claws and prevent Virus from going further and force him back to the front of Ifrit. Which would be made even easier if Virus did the pivot and small leap thing. But Ifrit is looking to hamper him in some way. So a shoulder or rib tag would also be fine by me. I just don't think Virus is going to be able to get away without a scratch.

Offline Kero

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Re: Virus vs. Ifrit
« Reply #27 on: September 02, 2012, 11:53:15 PM »
I said all my concerns... I really don't see the point of having to repeat them.

My biggest issue was that Scorn was under the assumption that I was ahead of his character when I was not, I was in the air, swiveling to face his side. That is why I was so confused in the first place as to what attacks could even be deemed valid. And once again... he mentioned in his first paragraph that Virus was too close to attack with his claws DURING the time he was in midair so how can he still attack with them when he said first thing he couldn't? It's contradicting what he wrote.

Edit: I'd like to add in that even if we go with that he ducked his head, getting hit by the ear, turned his head, try to bite, try to lift his paw and claw me all at the same time... wouldn't there be more than enough time for Virus to finish his spin, then kick off again like it was said he did once his paws reached the ground, continuing his movement? Virus was already in midair while he struck, so he should have been finished his spin by the time Ifrit ducked his head. Unless Ifrit has super speed, Virus should have completed his first spin before the bite and claw even lifted.
« Last Edit: September 03, 2012, 12:22:12 AM by Kero »

Offline Sukara (2 RPs)

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Re: Virus vs. Ifrit
« Reply #28 on: September 03, 2012, 12:26:35 AM »
It was just so I can give the team the gist of your point and then they could read all this clutter. Trying to make it easier to get your point across so additude isn't really needed? Anyway this threads on hold, well give you guys a verdict asap

Offline Kero

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Re: Virus vs. Ifrit
« Reply #29 on: September 03, 2012, 01:02:39 AM »
I wasn't trying to give attitude?